Sunday, June 7, 2009


I'm not a racist, I have friends who are (fill in the blank).
The funny thing about segregation is that it is a natural tendency.
Just look at every one's blog roll.
Most of the minority bloggers grew up in or acquired what is commonly considered a "White" lifestyle.
But why are so many on their blog rolls other people with similar racial and ethnic backgrounds?
Even when people don't know people, there is a tendency to self segregate.
So were Martin and others wrong in preaching the concept of integration?
Was Malcolm able to see a better method?
Is what we really wanted just the opportunity to integrate?
(And not integration itself.)


Mr. Noface said...

There are two things at work here, the law and the culture. Racist laws created a culture of segregation (and second class citizenship for POC’s). Getting rid of the former did not automatically guarantee that the latter would also disappear.

I believe folks of the Civil Rights era were fighting to change the laws with the expectation that future generations would be better able to fight to change the culture. This did not happen (or it did not happen at the level that it should have) so, although the law has been changed, the culture still remains. could just be that people want to be in situations where they can be themselves, as much as possible. The common thinking may be that you cannot be yourself when in diverse company, so people self segregate (but that is just another aspect of the culture).

FreeMan said...

" could just be that people want to be in situations where they can be themselves, as much as possible" I often tell my boy from El Salvador the most we have in common is poverty and the Lakers. If we really had a choice it would just be the Lakers.

We just wanted the access to resources we didn't want this diversity crap. The Civil Rights people thought by sticking close it'll be hard to discriminate so they sent the kids to their schools. Every part of integration most whites fought and moved and packed up and left.

So Malcolm is right because it's just a better situation when everyone has access to a better life uninhibited by others. Pride and confidence and better overall dealings come across becuase race is somewhat off the table. I have mine and he got his and I don't have a reason to cause him any problems.

We never wanted integration its not in our best interest. We wanted access to information, money and power.

uglyblackjohn said...

@ NoFace - The funny thing is a lot of people who would have been considered "Toms" in their old environment - they are now in groups of many other "Toms".
I was on one of the networking sites and noticed how "Black" so many had become.
It would seem that these people didn't say "I don't want to be Black" but instead what was meant was "I don't want to be that kind of Black".

@ FreeMan - "We wanted access to money, information and power."

brohammas said...

that is misseducation #1 in my middle school history class. We )a bunch of white kids)were taught the civil rights movement was about equality and ideals of treating everyone fairly... ya know getting along and liking each other. We were taught this was our part.

Then I found out that was a white interpretation. It wasnt about liking each other, it was as Peter Tosh said "I don't want no peace, I want equal rights, and Justice."

Mr. Noface said...

@ FreeMan

“We never wanted integration it’s not in our best interest. We wanted access to information, money and power.”

If that is all that we wanted via the Civil Rights movement, then it has been largely a failure. Changing the law hasn’t done much in terms of progress in those fronts (I speak of our race in America at the macro level). I say this because access to at least two of those things (information and power) require in my opinion, integration (diversity) beyond the laws on the books.

For example, information requires diversity, because if we self segregate we only get information from molded in our perspective and we miss out on much, making us ill equipped for the trials of the wider world (in terms of social interactions). This is especially important because the issues involving race and equality are not always “Whites vs. Minorities”, but is more often than not “White vs. Minorities vs. Minorities vs. Minorities” (another result of the lack of integration beyond the letter of the law). I do not believe that self segregation is not in our best interest, indeed it helps maintain a status quo where we are on the bottom (or on the outside looking in, even when we are inside).

@ Ugly Black John

Complete and totally integration is always going to elude us (especially with in the black community).

@ Brohammas

And that's the thing, those things are co-dependant (equal rights, peace, and justice), in which if one is missing you can’t really have the others. There are indeed two (or more interpretations of the Civil Rights movement, but which interpretation is the flawed one?

uglyblackjohn said...

@ brohammas - But see... I WANT peace.
But peace can only come from equality (or realizing equality).
By always saying that we are the victims - we assert a form of inferiority.
With this sense of being subjugated - we create a mentality (and then the environment) of being the "lesser" people.
Our (Black) mentality needs to change.

@ NoFace - Integration isn't necessary if it's not desired.
The CHOICE (or freedom) to integrate (or segregate) is what matters.

Mr. Noface said...

Then how do we upset the status quo if not by integration (beyond having just the choice)? Where many see self reliance and self determination within the dominant culture, I see divide and conquer by the dominant culture.